What exactly is Interior Secretary Ryan Zinke's vision of the National Park Service in years to come? That's a pertinent question not only in light of the Trump administration's directive that Interior shed $1.5 billion from its budget for the coming fiscal year, and cut nearly 1,250 full-time positions from the Park Service, but also because of the secretary's view of the skill set of Park Service employees.
During an appearance last week before the Recreation Vehicle Industry Association, Secretary Zinke voiced his desire to outsource various aspects of running the National Park System, and the topic of operating campgrounds came up.
"As the secretary, I don't want to be in the business of running campgrounds," the secretary said, according to a story by E&E News. "My folks will never be as good as you are."
Going a step further, Mr. Zinke added that, "We'll be looking at where our employees should be spending their time. ... Yes, cleaning the bathrooms. But actually running services, that's something we should be pushing to somebody who's updated and knows the market better."
Now, the RVIA expertise is not in managing campgrounds, but rather as serving as a trade group for RV manufacturers and parts suppliers. The National Park Service, however, has a long history of managing campgrounds. For the secretary to state that park employees should be cleaning bathrooms while managing campgrounds is outsourced runs counter to that history.
"The NPS has a long and proud history of managing campgrounds across the country. We have many repeat customers who come to the parks because our rangers and maintenance employees provide quality services and programs that result in an outstanding visitor experience," said Phil Francis, who wrapped up his 41-year Park Service career with eight years as superintendent of the Blue Ridge Parkway, which has eight campgrounds.
"I have met a number of NPS employees over the years who decided to join the NPS as a result of meeting park rangers while camping and hiking in national parks. It is important that the Service be allowed to continue that traditional service," he continued in an email to the Traveler.
Beyond that, Mr. Francis added that outsourcing management of campgrounds is not a good solution for the Park Service.
"I have had some experience with contracted campgrounds, and have found that the Service is asked to continue much of the maintenance workload, especially capital projects when campgrounds are contracted out, thus allowing private operators to receive a return on investment that they expect," he said. "While we can always strive to improve, my decades of experience tells me that this idea will likely not work."
Also opposed to privately managed campgrounds is the National Parks Conservation Association, where John Garder said past experience has shown it's not a panacea for insufficient Park Service funding.
"While concessions play an important role in our parks, so do the many park rangers who are a central part of the experience for the visitors who value them. And as the Park Service found in both the '80s and '90s when it examined possibilities for privatizing additional services, it's usually not cost-efficient because the private sector needs to make a profit ... unless of course fees are increased to a point that they're likely inappropriately high for public lands Americans collectively own," said Mr. Garder, NPCA's director of budget and appropriations.
What other proposals Mr. Zinke has for seeing that the Park Service provides visitors with a great experience in spite of a significant budget and staffing cut remain to be seen. While the secretary on May 23 told reporters that the president's proposed budget would allow the Park Service "to take care of what we have" across the Interior landscape, he's yet to outline proposals to explain how Interior in general, and the Park Service specifically, will do that if Congress approves the budget.
The secretary's spokeswoman, Heather Swift, when asked by the Traveler how the already straining Park Service will manage such a cut and still provide a quality visitor experience while protecting park resources, replied via email that unspecified innovations and efficiencies would make it possible.
"You're asking the question assuming process and organization remains the same, but it won't be. This administration is committed to improving the way government works by being more innovative and more efficient and by collaborating with local communities and outside partners," Ms. Swift wrote. "Plus, we will look at ways to increase revenue. Last year we made $15 billion LESS from offshore revenues than we did in 2008. That's a lot of money every year, especially when you consider the the NPS maintenance backlog is around $12 billion. The president's budget increased funding for the backlog.
"As the secretary said: 'I'm confident we will find innovative solutions for cost reduction, like public private partnerships, and revenue generation that will improve both sides of the books,'" she added.
Traveler footnote: Offshore royalties earned by the federal government from oil and gas production do not flow directly to the Interior Department or the National Park Service, and so can't be counted on to wipe out the agency's estimated maintenance backlog of roughly $11.3 billion. Nearly a third of the royalties head to the state where the fossil fuels were recovered, $150 million goes directly to the Historic Preservation Fund, up to $900 million flows to the Land and Water Conservation Fund, some goes to the federal agency that manages the area, and the remainder goes to the U.S. Treasury, according to the Interior Department.
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Comments
We dodged the "Privatize the Parks" cannonball under the Cheney administration.
But it's going to be a much more difficult battle under the Insane administration.
I fear this is only the first salvo in what will prove to be a major battle.
Drumpf and his billionaire buddies recognize only one thing. $$$$$$$$$. (And a Great Big Ego.)
You keep getting your president's wrong. It was the last one that gave everything to his "billionaire buddies" and sold anything that wasn't nailed down to anyone who would donate to his campaign. And talk about HUGE ego, who was the president that flew a 747 to the Grand Canyon to say that only He could have stopped climate change? (while standing in front of a canyon created by climate change)
Spot on Lee.
If there is something to be gleaned from Zinke's outsourcing proposal and fuzzy math, it is to show the true colors of the Republican party with regard to public lands. It was all a ruse to get these public lands in private, concession hands. So he can get back on his fake Teddy Horse and ride straight to the General Accounting office and explain to the public what he did with all that "travel expenditure" money he personally blew through.
In the meantime, before Trump gets gone, these guys are giving away every piece of taxpayer property to business interests be it at home or abroad. Republicans need to put country over party and get rid of this dangerous fascist in the White House before someone realizes how vulnerable we are both financially and militarily with his politics of division. Every person in his circle is crooked. Do we need more evidence to prove the same about Comrade Trump?
Did you miss history class in school? Your definition of Fascist is not what sane people would say it is. Now for the rest of your clueless rant: Please show your fuzzy facts and logic. No proposals have been made. The Trump Administration so far has been very pro National Parks and against any drilling. Whereas the Obama regime was all set to put drills in many west coast National Parks had Hillary won. Yet you all seem to skip over the truth and go for the tinfoil hat conspiracies.
Crooked people in his circle? Who's circle had a tax cheat, a convicted terrorist, and criminal who sold drilling rights to Russia? That would be Obama.
The Republican Party as compared to the Democratic party is showing their true colors. Red, White and Blue. The Democratic party is crumbling and now we are finally seeing just how much they hate anything American, including national parks! Trees are racists!!
Again, which party or president sat ideally by as the NPS let the copyrights of national landmarks go to the highest corporate bidder? Hint: starts with a "D".
Just what this country needs, even more handouts for corporations. Besides public goodwill & legacy marketing, I'd bet the NPS also would provide law enforcement, emergency services and interpretive programs to further private profit.
What's the big to-do. Private companies already run campgrounds in many of our parks including Yellowstone, Great Smokey, Rocky Mountain, Teton, Mesa Verde, Crater and many more.
EC,
Which campground or campgrounds in Great Smokey Mtn NP are run by private companies?
Thanks - OB
They do? That's news to me. Please explain what private companies already run campgrounds in many of our National Parks.
Xanterra corp runs the campgrounds and lodges in Yellowstone for sure. Many of the major parks out West have turned over the running of all concessions to corporations, and its been that way for years. I know Grand Canyon North rim and South Rim are run by two different ones.
Guest12345 says "Xanterra corp runs the campgrounds and lodges in Yellowstone for sure." .
Campgrounds; actually Xanterra only runs five (Grant Village, Canyon, Bridge Bay, Fishing Bridge RV Park and Madison) of the 12 frontcountry campgrounds in Yellowstone. NPS runs the remaining seven plus the backcountry camping network. Prices at the Xanterra run campgrounds range from $24.25 to $47.75 per night. The NPS frontcountry campgrounds cost $15 to $20 per night. Some of the concession run campgrounds offer more comfort features such as showers, hook ups, or laundry facilities.
Guest12345 Says "Many of the major parks out West have turned over the running of all concessions to corporations, and its been that way for years. I know Grand Canyon North rim and South Rim are run by two different ones."
On the South Rim a concessioner, Delaware North, runs Trailer Village RV Park, Trailer Village is adjacent to the larger NPS run Mather Campground, the other developed campground on the South Rim is the NPS campground at Desert View.
The North Rim Campground is run by the NPS, there is no concessioner run campground within the park on the North Rim. There a couple great US FS campgrounds outside the park as well as some commercial campgrounds too.
There's a place for both concession run and NPS run campgrounds in the parks and it seems to work well that way. The NPS run campgrounds are almost always going to be a less expensive option for park visitors, the concession operations will almost always have some additiional conveniences that some visitors will want and will pay a bit more for, it works well that way.
But please don't make blanket statements that are inaccurate or just plain wrong to try and make a point. A little research goes a long way.
They do not. They run lodging, restaurants, and outfitters. The whole purpose of the push by Zinke is to get control of campgrounds too.
Maybe Mr. Zinke should stay in a few of these 'private' campgrounds. Most 'corporate' ones are run poorly. The rest are privately run by folks that barely scrape together a few nickels. Campgrounds are not a profitable business, that's why they need run by the government. The government is not all about making money, something we need to come to grips with. Get back to me when we start making a profit defending the world from ISIS maybe.
Evidence the fiasco with the concessions contract. The government is going to lose a ton of money on that one in the end.
A man in a new job is voicing an opinion. How dare he!! He should be just like the one from the Obama regime and just wait for the signal from the POTUS to see who donated to their campaign and what rules you need to change to accommodate them. Like the previous
Everyone knows that:
Private mining in national parks = Good (as long as the mining company donates to a specific private charity)
Private campgrounds in national parks = Bad
Based on what I have read on this website the last year or so, I'm figuring if KOA gave a huge donation to "Onward Together" the opinion on private campgrounds would change and you would be in favor of them? (Onward Together is Hillary Clinton's rebranding of her foundation)
The NPS is biting off more than they can chew. On one hand they want a 100 more national monuments and parks and on the other hand, they are screaming that they have no money to maintain the current ones. Guess what? You can't have it both ways. Spend your money doing your job and proving you are good stewards of the NPS system and you would be rewarded with a bonus. Prove you prefer to play
Spend your budget doing your job and proving you are good stewards of the NPS system and you would not be in this position. Keep playing politics and mismanage your budget, and you get your chain pulled back.
Pretty simple to figure out
Mark, I think you really don't know what you're talking about. Some examples of where I believe you are ignorant of facts:
1. Mining in National Parks is BAD.
2. This has nothing to do with Obama or Hillary Clinton (if you hadn't noticed, neither of them were elected)
3. The NPS doesn't want more national monuments or parks (It's the Congress or the President that creates new NPS units, not the NPS)
4. National Parks ARE underfunded, as evidenced by the massive maintenance backlog. This isn't due to NPS 'mismanaging' a budget. It's due to Congress not providing adequate funding.
Whee. we seem to have stirred up a nest of pure fiction.
OB - I don't know but the NPS lists Tsiyahi, LLC as operating a campground(s) in the park as well as "Rentals; Retail Operations; ........Vending Machines; Food Service Operations"
According to the list that eccuck mentions but won't cite (https://www.nps.gov/grsm/getinvolved/upload/2015-List-of-Concessioners-2...), Tsiyahi LLC runs the Cades Cove concession. Which is a store. Next to a campground. Not a campground.
Let's all grant ecbuck the same good faith that he grants everyone else. Since he's wrong about this one thing, he's wrong about all things forever and all time.
How's it feel to be wrong and .... that you won't link to documents?
This comment was edited to remove a gratuitous comment.--Ed.
Let me google:
More than happy to link documents. Nobody asked.
https://concessions.nps.gov/concessioners.htm?filter_park-set=park-set48
Tsiyahi, LLC
c/o: Tsiyahi, LLC
101 S. San Francisco St. Santa Fe, NM 87501
Services: Rentals; Retail Operations; Campgrounds; Vending Machines; Food Service Operations
And if you search GSMNP specifically for campground operators you get this:
https://concessions.nps.gov/concessioners.htm?filter_park-set=park-set48
If the NPS is in error, I apologize on their behalf.
I asked the question about who operates the campgrounds at Great Smokey Mtn NP here is their answer:
"All of the campgrounds within Great Smoky Mountains National Park are operated by the park service. There are two campgrounds, Cades Cove and Elkmont, which have small campground stores associated with them. These stores sell camping supplies as well as firewood and ice. The Cades Cove Store also rents bikes and provides quick service and grab and go food."
If you have any other questions, please let me know!
Molly
Molly Schroer
Concessions Management Specialist
It'a not the fault of the person who tagged that database entry that you can't be bothered to look beyond metadata for actual data.
You made a large reading comprehension error. You obviously did no searching for corroboration. Together that shows just how seriously we should take your pronouncements.
A concession built, maintains, and runs the RV campground at the South Rim of the Grand Canyon. Public money built, maintains, and runs the other campground right next door. Letting a private company charge for other while the public still cleans its toilets is almost a textbook definition of rent-seeking. Generally, rent-seeking is a feature of feudalism or kleptocracies and not capitalist states with responsive governments.
Sorry Let me Google. I had the theory that information provided by the NPS about concessionaires on their pages specifically dedicated to information about concessionaires would be accurate. If, indeed GSMNP has no concesionaire run campground, then obviously that theory is wrong. Ergo, propertly using the scientific method, I will reject that theory.
The point is moot however, because as others have corroborated, there are already many places where concessionaires run campgrounds - which is the original point I was making.
By the way, LMGTFY, I am dubious when it comes to your claim that the NPS is cleaning the bathrooms in Trailer Village. Can you document that?
http://wate.com/2017/08/28/sale-of-interior-secretarys-motor-home-raises...
So what? If Buttrey, who is pitiching for an Interior job, sold it to Zinke at supposed half price, you might have an issue. With the sale going the opposite way, I see none, except the absurdity of some of our campaign finance rules.
Kurt: Great exposure to the boil on the butt of the NPS. The very essence of the NPS is the Ranger. Farming out the essential contact zones to private enterprise is simply foolish and points to total privatization of "America's Best Idea." The campground I worked in, Jenny Lake Ranger Station--Grand Teton, in the early 1970s was patrolled by rangers who also did mountain rescue, road patrol, river patrols, campfire programs, etc. This was the allure of the parks and also the visitor who longed to join the NPS (and I did indeed, recruit several visitors). Jenny Lake today is well run, but lacks the ranger contacts with the visitor. And, I'll add that I was paid about $3.10/hour for my services and loved every minute.....in fact, I think I'll volunteer my services again to this currently distressed NPS.
Depends. Talking about trademarks? If you look up when the trademarks were registered, there was a whole slew of them from 2002 to 2003, which is right around the administration of George W Bush. There were some older registrations, like The Ahwahnee and Bracebridge Dinner around 1988-1989, which would have been during the Reagan and first Bush administrations.
I'm not necessarily of the opinion that having a third party manage a campground somehow lessens the experience. It's sort of a combination of management at many campgrounds. In Yosemite the rangers handle the campground office, but the kiosks are typically run by nonprofits and other caretakers. I've stayed at a campground operated under contract by Xanterra, and I found the experience fairly reasonable. For the most part the rangers were still doing ranger duty such as looking for improperly stored food and operating campfire programs.
I've liked the experience at sevral Forest Service campground where the essential operations were contracted out to California Land Management. For the most part they seemed to bring in retired people who had the opportunity to live in their RVs as the campground hosts. I remember seeing one couple's grandson sweeping up, and where I inquired about paying for a second car's parking permit.
And now, a little info on how Zinke prioritizes budget expenditures.
Clue: Interior Department spends over $138,000 on Zinke's office door.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/interior-department-door-ryan-zinke...
Interior claims that this expensive door was planned long ago, and Zinke was unaware of its cost. While this may be true, Zinke's and his spokesperson's lack of candor on other issues makes it doubtful. Hopefully the OIG will add this to its investigation of Zinke's travel excesses. Now we learn that, in addition to his personal flag which is flown whenever the Secretary is "In garrison" (inside the building), he has had special coins minted with his name on them.
"The secretary was not aware of this contract but agrees that this is a lot of money for demo, install, materials, and labor," the DOI spokeswoman, said in a statement.
This is the same leadership team who is reviewing (and delaying) cooperative agreements over 40k to long-standing DOI partners but they had no idea this expense was in the works?
The same leadership who wants to move offices all over the country as well as throughtout the Interior buidling based on personal preferences regardless of the costs and impacts but they had no idea this expense was in the works?.
Maybe the doors do cost that much because of the type of building and dimension of the door and the needs and standards required. Just say that if that is the case - rather than just say the decision was made before we got here - plenty of other decisions were made before they arrived that have been overturned!!
At least the doors will keep the nice furniture and stuffed animals dry.
https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/interior-department-ryan-zinke-flag...
I have cleaned the bathrooms at Pipestone NM, Lassen Volcanic NP, Mount Rainier NP, and the people who are maintenance workers or laborers are the ones doing the cleaning, not the rangers. Never wore a smoky hat. I do not think having people employed by other entities, aside from the ones already doing this is a good idea. People who work for the NPS generally do so because of their love of the land and inspiration of the parks. I'm not sure someone hired by a concessionaire would have the same feelings/beliefs. Some will for sure, but the way NPS hires seasonals is a process that many people without that love would not do. This is just my opinion.